Max Mutchnick (right) is the creator of Will & Grace and the stereotypical married-with-children gay… not that there's anything wrong with that. Until you start trashing the other type of "gay" which is exactly what he did in this HuffPo piece.
Here's a choice quote:
"Anyhoo, when we were planning our weekend, I thought it might be a cool
idea to take the kids to Gay Pride after music class. I could just see
us putting them in Baby Bjorns and walking amongst our people and
really being a part of it. But as I sat in my car, watching from the
periphery, I started to worry. Were these my people? I used to get
comforting goose bumps at Gay Pride parades. I am a part of something.
These sexual outlaws and gender pioneers are my brothers and sisters
and we are part of a community. But for the first time, I felt like an
outsider. Dykes on bikes, Tarzana Trannies, Jewish Leather Daddies and Kathy
Griffin's mom. Don't get me wrong. I love these people. Let's call them
the 'Usual Suspects.' They fought for my rights and taught me how to
dance. But they should no longer be representing 'the pride.'"
Hmmm can anyone else say condescending and boring? I mean, I get political sometimes but hot damn I still enjoy half-naked men and leather daddies, especially at Pride! I really don't think we have to compromise our sexuality and fun sides to get our rights.
With other lines like "I wish they'd read more and drink less" I don't think Max is making many friends in the gay community.
What are your thoughts?
– Andy
I think he grew up.
its about fucken time someone with power realized that mistakes of overly drunk overly sexualized gays. i hope more people will take to heart his message. he is right every single word strikes a chord.
If you took a moment to stop being so defensive about the promiscuity that pervades in our community (as indicated by the resurgence of HIV infection and other STD’s), you might realize that he’s right. Its time for gay men to start taking some responsibility for their actions and stop being so consistently hypocritical.
He just moved on…Not every gay person in America has to get wild and crazy during pride…everything he does in his life is not wrapped around his sexuality…He grew up…It happens.
So, in other words, unless you gentrificate in heterosexual society, you have no place in gay society?
I think he forgot where he came from now that he’s established and wealthy. PRIDE participants are as they’ve been for decades and there’s nothing wrong w/ it. Max took what he could from the experience at the time when he really needed that type of re-enforcement; now that he’s rich, he’s throwing the same judgements people threw at him 30 yrs ago…before he “made it” Shame on him!
^^^^^^^^^^
Says the men that go to manhunt or read the blog. Sirs you are both contradictions….
This really is a tricky one. In some ways the [extreme] stereotypes can work against “the cause”. The most flamboyant and sexually agressive floats in a gay pride parade might be influencing how regular people think of us “regular gays” that want to marry, adopt and join the army. (Of course for every extreme there are a thousand “normal” gays and lesbians, but they just don’t stick out at gay pride.
But then you can think beyond that: why should we conform to some heteronormative moralist idea of gay normality, and who is to say a screaming drag queen or a sado-maso leather bear has any less a place in marriage, parenthood, armed forces or elsewhere.
I’m still a bit torn on the subject. A flamboyant friend of mine once reminded me that while the suit-and-tie homos stayed at home it was the fierce queens and over-the-top gays that went to the streets and started pride, with it’s in-your-face attitude and to-heck-with-norms message.
But today these extremes might be adding to society’s prejudice rather than reducing it (silly society!). Another friend put it this way: if a teen comes out to his grandparents they’re not so worried about him liking cock. -they’re worried about him wanting to put on a tiara. Likewise gay closeted and confused youth might find it more difficult to face their own sexual preference when such extremes are what’s most prevalent in the media -extremes that probably have very little to do with their lifestyle and ambitions in life apart from the “being gay” part.
Then there are my personal preferences that probably add to my prejudice: I don’t enjoy the company of people who belong to the “gay extreme”. As far as I can remember I’ve felt (and experienced) that I have very little common ground with those people and many times get a feeling that their extreme attitude/behavior has to do with a personality “deficiency” of theirs, be that insecurity, thirst for attention, thirst for “belonging”, sexual insecurity, need to conform to a stereotype (or lack of ability to be “themselves”).
Sometimes I suspect that people who belong to these gay extreme stereotypes haven’t really been able to reconcile themselves with being gay (strange as it may sound). Being gay has become too much of a focal point in their lives rather than being just a part of their life. Sort of like the difference between a football fan and football hooligan.
Maybe there’s such a thing as too much of a good thing?
couldn’t have said it better
nevermind
They GREW Up and see you can get more done without throwing the gay pride steriotypes in peoples faces. Its actually embarrassing to think that wearing assless chaps or men in dog collors or trannies dressed like prisilia queen of the desert and dykes on bikes, is supposed to represent us. Please…..Bravo for these two men who grew up
And they make a nice family as well
You know, it’s trannies, the dykes, the leather daddies, the twink, the drag queens that made our community. Each one makes up different aspects of our community. It isn’t about growing up, it’s about having fun at least one day a year. Many of these people we see at Prides across America take that one day to take off the suit and tie and throw on some assless chaps, or take a shower in glitter, or dress up like Dorothy Gale and take PRIDE in the fact the we are a unique group and that we are different and aren’t ashamed of that fact. I, for one, celebrate our diversity. Let’s not forget, who was it that fought for our rights at Stonewall? Drag Queens. It was the fuck me pump that was thrown that was heard around the world. Why must we fit in? I refuse to fit in, because I don’t want to fit in. This is who we are, we celebrate it through PRIDE.
They make up aspects of our community, but they are hardly representative. Where is the float for the hard-working, responsible fathers? What about the armed forces members? In other words, why can we only show our daring, and never our dignity?
I agree with Andy, because he doesn’t trash the family, he thinks that’s cool but he also doesn’t think the family guy should trash the rest of the community. that’s the perfect stance when i’m concerned, live and let live.
and tyler, every pride i’ve been HAS had floats for gay familes, political groups would you really want a pride that’s JUST that?
I’m sorry but you are ALL a bunch of hypocrites, on manhunt, but saying we need to grow up? puhleaze. I’m all for families and wish to one day have one, but the gay community is also sexual and fun and crazy, do you really want to emulate straight couple just to be accepted? PFFT
I am so glad this issue was brought up! Every year I leave my hometown because the pride festival in my city upsets me so much. My grandmother shouldn’t have to turn on the news and see drugged out twinks covered in glitter dancing on a flatbed truck representing the local gay club. How does that represent pride? How does that celebrate unity? What does doing all the stuff that happens at 130AM on a Saturday in the middle of a Sunday afternoon accomplish?
Did anyone actually read the article? The guy says, yes, he’s tired of being represented by drunk twinks looking to score ONLY. He’s not saying gays shouldn’t celebrate who they are, nor is he saying they should all conform to one boring, suit-and-tie version that can pass for straight.
He’s saying that it would be nice if our community was represented by more than just partying, sex-addicted children.
Wow I was gonna say something but I say live and let live.
I guess the jockstrap porn stars are needed for the sponsorchip money.
I guess it is a part of who we are and we shouldnt forget it all.
We are fun, sexual, strong, serious individuals. We are oxymorons.
We are all made of dualities.
I dont think he said anything wrong. In fact, I agree with him completely. I know these people fought for our rights but I’m still tired of the freak show at gay pride events. Why cant gay people be more mainstream? Actually, things have improved drastically in recent years. I just went to the gay pride event in Washington and noticed that it was much more mainstream than in prior years.
Judging gays based on a pride parade is like judging college students based on spring break on the beach. Its just a snapshot, and shouldn’t be taken to be indicitave of the general appearance, behavior, or attitude of the group.
I’ve never identified with the stereotypes that are the center of attention at Gay Prides, and I’ve never understood how they can represent the gay community at large. I am gay and I accept the existence of those subtypes, but I’ve never been proud of them.
A very ironic thing just happened where GLAAD protested against “Bruno” for perpetuating negative gay stereotypes. In the same month when similar stuff is paraded all around the country under the name of “GAY PRIDE.” HELLO??
For Thommie who said you want to be different and don’t want to fit in, I hope you are only speaking for yourself. I think it’s hypocritical to ask for equality and reject conformance at the same time. “We never want to be like you but we want you to see us as the same as you.” How silly is that? If you want to stay out of the mainstream, don’t be surprised if you are not understood. If you don’t want to be marginalized, don’t marginalize yourself.
Excuse me, but there are homosexuals who have no desire to have children, no desire to settle down, no desire to get married and become housewives, and they have just as much right to be themselves and not ridiculed for it as anyone else! The fact that you’re too concerned with what other people are going to think of you is YOUR HANG UP, and not everyone else’s. Go put on your suits and ties, have your babies, change your diapers, and have your own damn parades. Gay Pride has a history and tradition!
Don’t call it Gay Pride then, just call it Freak Pride.
Who cares? I’m sick of gays trying to be straight. We are not straight, we shouldnt have to assymilate into straight society to be accepted. Do whatever you want, be whoever you want to be. It doesnt matter. The thing that is wrong is going agains”t your true nature. I always figured pride was a sort of, “in your face straight world” kinda thing. We can come out, in ,drag, in leather, in anything that was once hidden or secret or shameful, and march in the streets, proud of who we are. That doesnt mean, that monday morning rolls around and were still covered in glitter. Life resumes, and we go back to straight society, and mix in. I am sorry but i will not bow to a society that still thinks what i am is an illness, or an abomination. I don’t care what straight people think, i dont care what their opinion of gay people is, who gives a shit what straight society thinks, or how they view us? Oh, i guess alot of you do. Pride festivals are a symbol, a parody almost of gay life. Its meant to be over the top, and wild. if not we would be marching in polos and khakis, holding neat signs reading: Straight people, we are just like you, see, you can accept us, hell we don’t even have sex, or atleast when we look just like you, act just like you, you don’t have to think about our differences,or our nasty sex lives!
“We never want to be like you but we want you to see us as the same as you.”
Gays, guys, bis whatever you are, please don’t forget that you ARE different. No matter how much you try to be “mainstream” you still suck cock, you are still a faggot! Accept it, and embrace it
Reminds me of something i heard (I think on queer as folk nonetheless lol) Don’t ever forget that you are a jew, never forget that you are different. For as soon as you do, someone, somewhere,will quickly remind you.
He is a family man now so of course he feels different from the ”gay extremes” . Straight people do have a crazy life too (groupies , punks etc) before family and kids. Nothing to hoo ha about what he said.
I’ve got an idea. Let’s tone down Mardi Gras so people can bring their kids in strollers!! Let’s do away with the whole beads and showing your junk and drinking stuff, let’s make it a family event!!! I mean really, who wants to go to Mardi Gras when there are all these hot people flashing their naughty bits all over the place!!?? Grow up!!
See how ridiculous that sounds? Yeah. Obviously there’s a time and a place for everything, and knowing what Gay Pride has evolved into, there’s probably a better way for you to show your pride if you want to bring your kids and grandparents. Why don’t you have a gay pride BBQ and invite over all your friends. Leave the parades to the eccentric people that love them.
Well, Mardi Gras is not called “Straight Pride” is it?
Since when did wearing normal clothes and wanting to have kids equal “trying to be straight” or “bowing to the society”? What I see some of you saying, is that we are supposed to CONFIRM & CONFORM to the straight world’s MISUNDERSTANDING that “being gay” = being in drag, in leather, sex in public, etc. What message are we presenting to gay teenagers? That in order to “accept yourself being gay,” you have to look and act like a freak, be wild, act sexual in public, and so on?
Here’s a thought: If we keep on acting like we are repressed, there will always be repression. If we don’t want the misconceptions to persist, stop being so obsessed with them ourselves.
I didn’t mention heterosexuality whatsoever in my reference of Mardi Gras. I was simply providing an example of another outrageous holiday/celebration that people participate in. Asking to tone it down is just … ridiculous. Obviously. Would you take your grandparents to Mardi Gras with you? Besides, nobody is saying that Mardi Gras revelers are an embarassment to heterosexuals, are they?
HomoSEXUALITY is a …. SEXUALITY!! Do you see where that word fits in? It’s a celebration of sexuality! But yeah, let’s take all the sex out of it. Right.